truth or dare MInes are Dangerous so is crossing the street

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Posted by Doug Billings on May 06, 2002 at 16:17:12:

In Reply to: Mine exploration 29 Palms & abroad posted by Doug Billings on May 03, 2002 at 00:33:02:

Well, this is surely an unexpected reply. I want to be careful here not to offend anyone, but that sounds impossible, so here goes.
First on my background. I have 22 years exploring caves and mines as an adult.
I consider myself as well as my fellow team to be extremely competent and safe. We train regularly including confined space and rope rescue. We also have invested thousands of dollars in proper equipment. Members of this group participate actively in a cave rescue team. Unlike other’s, I do not claim to be some crazy weekend yahoo. I know how to assess risk and use learned skills to do something that is inherently dangerous in a safe manner. Hence we have been doing this 22 years without a serious problem.
I have been in situations in caves that have made most of my mine experience looked like a walk in the park. But there is defiantly a problem with inexperienced people entering any underground space whether a cave, mine or other situtaion. Those people are not crazy, they are just stupid. But the same can be said for scuba diving, sking, mountain biking and so on.
Ok so ‘’’’’ this is where this started
I have spoke to a gentleman named Joel, but now I have read there are two Joels? Ok
That’s weird. But the gentleman I have corresponded with claims to have extensive experience in mine exploration and caves. I have never met him and do not personally know him. We have swapped emails a few times . He offered on his website “desert drifter” to hire experienced vertical cavers/mine explores for some mine exploration project. The pay offered was quite good and it sounded intereesting. I sent in a resume but was not chosen for the job. During this time though he said they do their vertical training in the Supply & Lorhman mines and invited myself to attend. There was also previous mention of trips down these mines in the recent past. Recently this same person solicited my services to train their team in Vertical SRT work. I was offered many trip reports, files, names, training dates, and photo’s, on the information I needed. I have yet to receive anything. red flags fly!! That’s why I thought I would post looking for others on the trip. So now I see postings stating “ stay out of mines they are dangerous, We are crazy. When I went down these mines etc.”” I am a little set back by that comment. It seems quite hypocritical if that is true. On another note, It is my opinion there is No Way any person could drop the Lorhman or Supply without lots of vertical gear and lots of experience. That would require acts only Spiderman could pull off, the Supply alone has a 100’ Tyrolean traverse over a pit to get to the first level. There are many more verifiable inconsistantcy's to the story as well. I think I may be the the sucker here. I thought everything on the interent was real. I am not to worried about it. I will sit back and laugh.
Again thanks for the one website lead. On Cal-mine explorers, I will send them a note. And if there is real info out there I would love to see it. Moderator, if you feel this is out of place for this site, please e-mail and I will
Stop posting on this subject.

Thank you again Doug Billings
National Speleological Society Life Member
Chairman DDT Grotto
Cave Trustee National Park Service
Hellenic Speleogical Society

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